Shocking development

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Re: Shocking development

Postby Havoc » Tue Feb 18, 2014 12:41 am

I see your point now. But as far as her going looking to Mimi's essences to fill the void: I feel like that's a pretty far off connection to make. It seems a bit unnatural to me to just have her come up with the idea by herself. I feel like Minnie would need something to help put those pieces together. Like if the essences somehow communicated with her, and promised her that it would give her the power she desired or something. But that's just me.
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Re: Shocking development

Postby Guardian » Tue Feb 18, 2014 2:13 am

Agreed with that remark of Havoc's.
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Re: Shocking development

Postby korikou » Tue Feb 18, 2014 5:58 am

Tenshi Nova wrote:
korikou wrote:Was anyone else totally shocked that Mimi couldn't make the cut in that fight? I'm sorry if this is taking focus away from the current discussion but I was just really surprised that she didn't shove that egg beater down that hunter's throat and turn it on full demonic charge!

How would Mimi win?
Remember that Skulker is a ghost, beings that can phase through solid matter.


True, but hell's fire burns souls doesn't it? I mean, demons don't fight spirits...they torture them, and they can do so fairly easily which leads me to the conclusion that demonic powers counteract ghostly ones right? It makes sense that Skulker can't phase through things like magic or demonic powers, those things are made to effect things not of the earthly realm.

Also, I agree with Havoc; I can just hear the essence whispering to her from the container.
Hello little one....you want power yes? power to take what is yours, power to claim a love so pure...free me from this container and I will give to you all that you have desired.....do this now....I swear he will be yours...
And then she shatters the container and the essence flies out, swarming around her until she's completely enveloped in the devil's hand...it would be awesome!
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Re: Shocking development

Postby GTFDB » Tue Feb 18, 2014 9:41 am

Does anyone else hope Mimi gets her powers back in this chapter?
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Re: Shocking development

Postby Darkingdomhearts » Tue Feb 18, 2014 10:03 am

I wonder if the Nergal even can be controlled by Minnie now. Jr. and Nerg have become such good friends now, I wonder if Nerg even cares about Minnie now.
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Re: Shocking development

Postby Tenshi Nova » Tue Feb 18, 2014 1:05 pm

korikou wrote:True, but hell's fire burns souls doesn't it? I mean, demons don't fight spirits...they torture them, and they can do so fairly easily which leads me to the conclusion that demonic powers counteract ghostly ones right? It makes sense that Skulker can't phase through things like magic or demonic powers, those things are made to effect things not of the earthly realm.

Where in the comic, or in their respective series, has this been stated?
What makes you think ghosts can't phase through magic?
When has Mimi showcased pyrokinetic abilities?


Darkingdomhearts wrote:I wonder if the Nergal even can be controlled by Minnie now. Jr. and Nerg have become such good friends now, I wonder if Nerg even cares about Minnie now.

You should the rest of the thread, Dark, we've had a couple of thoughts thrown back and forth.
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Re: Shocking development

Postby ari-6 » Tue Feb 18, 2014 2:49 pm

What he said is true in Supernatural at least, and while HIM has been shown to have power over souls, Mimi has no such power as far as we know.

@GTFDB: If Mimi's powers were removed only to wind up back with her again then it would seem completely pointless her losing them in the first place. Why even hint at the parasite's attraction to Minnie if you aren't going do do anything about it?
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Re: Shocking development

Postby Darkingdomhearts » Tue Feb 18, 2014 3:08 pm

Tenshi Nova wrote:
Darkingdomhearts wrote:I wonder if the Nergal even can be controlled by Minnie now. Jr. and Nerg have become such good friends now, I wonder if Nerg even cares about Minnie now.

You should the rest of the thread, Dark, we've had a couple of thoughts thrown back and forth.

I had done that already... (well I scanned the posts) just shared my thoughts about the subject...
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Re: Shocking development

Postby GTFDB » Tue Feb 18, 2014 3:18 pm

ari-6 wrote:What he said is true in Supernatural at least, and while HIM has been shown to have power over souls, Mimi has no such power as far as we know.

@GTFDB: If Mimi's powers were removed only to wind up back with her again then it would seem completely pointless her losing them in the first place. Why even hint at the parasite's attraction to Minnie if you aren't going do do anything about it?

I was just curious, you don't need to be jerk about it
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Re: Shocking development

Postby Tuor » Tue Feb 18, 2014 3:20 pm

It didn't come off very "jerk"-ish to me, knowing ari I don't think he intended it to
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Re: Shocking development

Postby Tenshi Nova » Tue Feb 18, 2014 3:45 pm

I think Ari was directing his answers towards the comic. It really would be annoying if the comic took away Mimi's powers, just to give it back to her, before anything noteworthy occurred. All this while hinting at the parasite's attraction to Minnie.
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Re: Shocking development

Postby korikou » Tue Feb 18, 2014 4:10 pm

I know that so far she hasn't showcased powers over souls but it makes sense that a girl imbued with the powers of a devil who at some point was meant to rule over the underworld (if we should go by the original bio) and is also the daughter of HIM would have some level of defense against spiritual beings

I mean she's a demon! A demon who draws her powers from the sins of the world and actually lives in hell, it would make way less sense if she didn't have any powers over things like that right?

Also, sense Skulker was in the other realm doesn't that mean he was tangible or does that rule only apply to the ghost zone?

I've never seen an instance in which magic didn't effect a spirit, again its main purpose is to control things of that nature. I've never seen magic not effect a ghost or a demon that couldn't touch a spirit (in most stories that's like their whole thing right?)

So no, it hasn't been shown yet but seeing as this comic uses the elements of every nickelodeon and cartoon network story line; I feel like my conclusion that ghosts are affected by magic and demons is pretty solid in this situation.

PS. Grims been affected in some pretty major ways the Grim Adventures series so I'm pretty sure that if the angel of death is affected, than this ghost for hire is definitely in that category

But honestly, this is all pretty much speculation so I could of course be wrong...oh well
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Re: Shocking development

Postby Tenshi Nova » Tue Feb 18, 2014 5:02 pm

korikou wrote:I know that so far she hasn't showcased powers over souls but it makes sense that a girl imbued with the powers of a devil who at some point was meant to rule over the underworld (if we should go by the original bio) and is also the daughter of HIM would have some level of defense against spiritual beings

Him rules one realm. A single realm in the Underworld. Him also has shown no way to actually fight ghosts. I don't see why Mimi, who should be considerably weaker than Him, would have a 'power' that can fight a ghost.

korikou wrote:I mean she's a demon! A demon who draws her powers from the sins of the world and actually lives in hell, it would make way less sense if she didn't have any powers over things like that right?

I don't see why her powers from sin would give her powers over ghosts. Ghosts aren't the subjects of sin. They died before their time and/or they can't rest due to events that occurred in their lives.

korikou wrote:Also, sense Skulker was in the other realm doesn't that mean he was tangible or does that rule only apply to the ghost zone?

Ghosts can become intangible in both the Ghost Zone and on Earth. I don't see why Skulker would lose that ability in Aku City.

korikou wrote:I've never seen an instance in which magic didn't effect a spirit, again its main purpose is to control things of that nature. I've never seen magic not effect a ghost or a demon that couldn't touch a spirit (in most stories that's like their whole thing right?)

Yet, in this series ghosts have shown a stronger affinity for magic than any other being. They control fire, ice, sound, interdimensional teleportation, abilty to change shape, clone themselves and so much more.
Is that magic? Or is that written in ghost DNA?
On top of all that, Mimi and Him show different abilities. I don't remember Him being able to pull eggbeaters out thin air, nor have I seen Mimi hypnotize and increase in size.

korikou wrote:So no, it hasn't been shown yet but seeing as this comic uses the elements of every nickelodeon and cartoon network story line; I feel like my conclusion that ghosts are affected by magic and demons is pretty solid in this situation.

Is it? Because, it doesn't seem you know much about the elements in Danny Phantom's universe.
I'm not saying you're wrong. I just disagree with your opinion. I don't see how magic and demons should be effective against ghosts from the DP universe.

korikou wrote:PS. Grims been affected in some pretty major ways the Grim Adventures series so I'm pretty sure that if the angel of death is affected, than this ghost for hire is definitely in that category

Grim isn't a ghost. Grim can get hurt with physical weapons, ghosts can not. The angel of death? The almighty angel of death lost a limbo bet to 2 kids. The ghosts aren't even under Grim's jurisdiction. Your statement has no merit behind it at all.

korikou wrote:But honestly, this is all pretty much speculation so I could of course be wrong...oh well

It's not bad to discuss things, just back it up with facts. I could be wrong too, we won't know until/unless it's addressed.
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Re: Shocking development

Postby korikou » Tue Feb 18, 2014 6:00 pm

1) Ghosts are the subject of sin, ghosts are made because a person can't move on after their deaths which is usually due to someone sinning against them. If the world were perfect, we wouldn't have ghosts. In the short time that Minnie was a spirit, she was stricken with both lust and Wrath in the same ten minute time span by none other than Mimi, which I guess means you can affect a ghost with sin.

2) Mimi does have a form of hypnosis, in which she invokes one of the seven deadly sins. And seeing as you noted HIM's inability to conjure things out of thin air, here's a list
A giant demon pinata
A giant stuffed octopus
A different reality
A Series of Chalk drawings that came to life
The Rowdy Rough Boys after they'd been completely destroyed
HIM has the ability to warp reality, sometimes on a large scale, sometimes on a small scale. It's been made pretty apparent throughout the series that he can do pretty much whatever he wants.

He moved the sun, dude!

THE SUN

I think he has the capabilities of summoning an eggbeater...

3)This isn't just the DP universe is it? This is the samurai Jack universe (a series in which magic effects an immortal demon god sorcerer) and this is the PPG universe (a series in which HIM is the master of all evil if you read his description)
For all we know this is also the Justice League Unlimited Universe! where one of the only ghosts in the show got stopped in his tracks when the sorceress bound him with a spiritual restraint spell.
This is also the Teen Titan universe and the Jack Skellington Universe where you can pet ghost dogs and they can apparently physically touch bones despite not being of the physical plain!
There are a literally hundreds of series and story-lines throughout the nickelodeon and cartoon network universes that we have to take a look at, the fact that this ghost is from DP means almost nothing because he is bound by the rules of every single universe in this comic and in many universes, as I am sure that you've seen at least once in the time you've spent watching cartoons as a kid or even on just a lazy Saturday morning...
Ghosts are affected by magic.
And honestly, why wouldn't they be? Magic is pretty much the only thing that can affect a ghost.

4) I did not call grim smart, I didn't even call him slightly witty! I called him the angel of death, an entity whose powers expand across the plains of reality like nobodies business...and that, he is. All I'm saying is that if that guy is affected by magic than the two inch tall ghost in a tin can suit that got hacked by a PDA might be affected too.

Is that really such a huge leap to make?

Look, all I'm saying is, why not?
Why wouldn't they be affected right?
It's not like it's a huge leap to make that conclusion based off of every show I've seen so far right?

Again, I might be wrong but if we take into account every universe, not just the DP...I'm kind of leaning towards my conclusion.
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Re: Shocking development

Postby Tenshi Nova » Tue Feb 18, 2014 6:33 pm

Oh? Skulker likely died from a hunting accident. Is the animal a sinner?

I see your points with Mimi and Him, they still haven't shown powers over ghosts though.

It's true that there are many other universes involved, but why must the DP universe change to match the ghosts in other universes?
Why can't all the other ghosts change to match DP's?
Your Zero example helps me btw. Ghosts being able to do as they please, in terms of tangibility.

Also, magic isn't the only thing that can work against ghosts. If it were, then the Fentons would've been studying magic.
Ghosts work against other ghosts, taking ectoplasm into account. Technology works against ghosts.
Physical attacks can hurt ghosts if they don't become intangible.
Pretty much anything can work on ghosts.
Magic? If the ghosts are tangible, I don't see why not. But, I also don't see why ghosts can't phase through certain forms of magic.
I didn't say ghosts are immune to magic.

Also, Grim still isn't a ghost.

I never said that your opinion is wrong. I just don't agree with it.
Plus, my original argument was that Mimi shouldn't have been able to beat Skulker, in that situation.
The idea that magic shouldn't be able to hurt ghosts while intangible, is something I should've probably made more clear when the discussion started.
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Re: Shocking development

Postby ULTRADJ » Tue Feb 18, 2014 6:44 pm

Just gonna throw this out there, but I just realized something. Him's child is Mimi, Mandy and Grim's children are Jr. and Minnie, Aku has Chi as a daughter, even Hunson has a daughter, Marceline! This begs the question (might've already been discussed, but I haven't seen it, so sorry) will Walker have a child/children of his own? That'd be a little interesting, maybe he'd hook up with Ember. XD
Also, speaking of universes, since Hunson is here, where are Finn and Jake? Probably in the Land of Ooo still all grown up and such.
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Re: Shocking development

Postby Darkingdomhearts » Tue Feb 18, 2014 7:05 pm

Tenshi Nova wrote:Oh? Skulker likely died from a hunting accident. Is the animal a sinner?

I think that all of the powers and "jobs" the ghost have in DP reflects how they may have died or at least did in their previous life. Skulker could have died in a hunting accident. Ember probably was a teen girl who died in a fire. Johnny and Kitty probably in a motor accident. Technus maybe because of an overdose of electricity, because he may have been a technician.

ULTRADJ wrote:Just gonna throw this out there, but I just realized something. Him's child is Mimi, Mandy and Grim's children are Jr. and Minnie, Aku has Chi as a daughter, even Hunson has a daughter, Marceline! This begs the question (might've already been discussed, but I haven't seen it, so sorry) will Walker have a child/children of his own? That'd be a little interesting, maybe he'd hook up with Ember. XD

I actually want to see Walker as a single man, he doesn't seem like the family type to me. However since they also have been dating in the DP show, I would like to see a kid of Skulker and Ember.

ULTRADJ wrote:Also, speaking of universes, since Hunson is here, where are Finn and Jake? Probably in the Land of Ooo still all grown up and such.

If I look at the time line in Grim Tales then it should only have been about 1-2 years after the world war. As Mimi's birthday the world pretty much had been destroyed and we currently are more than a year in the future from that. So I think Finn and Jake (we don't know why Finn is the last human, so speculation now) haven't been born yet. I think this may be the time that Simon and Marcy wandered the wreckage of the world.
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Re: Shocking development

Postby Tenshi Nova » Tue Feb 18, 2014 7:12 pm

I think someone suggested Walker and Spectra. I think it could work.
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Re: Shocking development

Postby ULTRADJ » Tue Feb 18, 2014 7:32 pm

Darkingdomhearts wrote:If I look at the time line in Grim Tales then it should only have been about 1-2 years after the world war. As Mimi's birthday the world pretty much had been destroyed and we currently are more than a year in the future from that. So I think Finn and Jake (we don't know why Finn is the last human, so speculation now) haven't been born yet. I think this may be the time that Simon and Marcy wandered the wreckage of the world.

That's right! It is more sensible that Finn and Jake aren't born yet and that Simon and Marcy are wandering the world considering the state it is in now, just like they did in the show.
Tenshi Nova wrote:I think someone suggested Walker and Spectra. I think it could work.

That could be more reasonable as well. I only said Ember because she was the first female ghost of the series that popped up in my head first at the time. Desiree could work as well as Walker's wife, but maybe Spectra would work better. But hey, for all we know now, he could be a single man. (and a player XD) But it is also reasonable that he could be a single man now looking for a heir to his kingdom, thus him needing a wife. This is all speculation surrounding the mystery known as this comic's version of Walker.
Edit: Another funny thought popped up in my head. What if Walker hooked up with Kitty? She dumped Johnny and decided to fling with Walker? It's possible, though incredibly unlikely, like, absolutely zero chance of that happening in this comic. But wouldn't that be the ultimate prank in this comic for that to happen? XD Like, Walker and Kitty had relations once, she got pregnant, and she ran off and now Walker has to take care of the kid because maybe he realizes that this will be the closest he'll get to having and heir without having a wife, or something to that effect. This is me just speculating and rambling.
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Re: Shocking development

Postby Darkingdomhearts » Wed Feb 19, 2014 6:44 am

Meh I prefer if Johnny and Kitty stay out of this comic. Fun characters but they have their "happy end" together. Spectra indeed looks interesting to be with Walker. I still don't know if that guy that always is with her is her boyfriend, husband or just a servant, the series never made that very clear, or I just forgot (like his name). But I think I would like Walker the most as a single man, or at least without a child.
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Re: Shocking development

Postby ari-6 » Wed Feb 19, 2014 9:37 am

ULTRADJ wrote:Just gonna throw this out there, but I just realized something. Him's child is Mimi, Mandy and Grim's children are Jr. and Minnie, Aku has Chi as a daughter, even Hunson has a daughter, Marceline! This begs the question (might've already been discussed, but I haven't seen it, so sorry) will Walker have a child/children of his own?
... Hmm, I think I can remember this conversation. How did it go again...?

@Koriku/Tenshi: I think if anyone were to have a power to help fight ghosts, it would be Jr, he has already been shown to be able to touch ghosts. I don't find it difficult to believe that through concentration, he could touch ghosts even when intangible. This however does not mean he wouldn't still get his ass kicked.
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Re: Shocking development

Postby pandabear » Wed Feb 19, 2014 1:51 pm

That mirror, its reflection doesn't line up from the angle of the camera point of view. It is not really a mirror but a portal to somewhere else, right?
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Re: Shocking development

Postby tonightscake » Wed Feb 19, 2014 1:58 pm

You're either thinking about the wrong page or you're talking about the guillotine. I don't see a mirror. :/
Why not?
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Re: Shocking development

Postby Darkingdomhearts » Wed Feb 19, 2014 2:08 pm

ari-6 wrote: I think if anyone were to have a power to help fight ghosts, it would be Jr, he has already been shown to be able to touch ghosts. I don't find it difficult to believe that through concentration, he could touch ghosts even when intangible. This however does not mean he wouldn't still get his ass kicked.

I wouldn't mind it, but what if Grim Jr. got the main character syndrome aka have the most powers which eventually become kinda op. For example Ichigo from Bleach he went from Human -> Shinigami -> Visored -> Fullbringer -> Quincy/Shinigami hybrid. So he actually is/was all races.

So I actually would like if Junior got the main character syndrome. He already is a Reaper and Nergaling, so maybe having something affaliated with Ghosts would be cool. And he probably also is part human because I think his father was a human too like his mother.
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Re: Shocking development

Postby Tenshi Nova » Wed Feb 19, 2014 2:11 pm

Nuuu. I hope that Jr didn't keep the ghost energy he had. It'd be ridiculous if he was also part ghost.

The main character syndrome(MCS) is one of the reasons Bleach is poorly written. Overpowered main characters just lead to predictability and poorly drawn out fights.
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